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Interviews : Arputham Jockin

The Magsaysay Award Winner and President of National Slum Dwellers Federation (NSDF) Arputham Jockin may fiercely argue the case of urban poor but as an individual he is so modest that he simplified his name Joaquin to Jockin for his equally simple slum dwelling members. 

It has been a Herculean task to convince slum dwellers that nothing comes free and also convince authorities to agree to his legitimate suggestions. But Jockin achieved this fete.

Arputham Jockin reflected on a wide range of issues in a free-wheeling exclusive interview to IndianNGOs.com. 

How and when did you begin to work for the cause of urban poor and slum dwellers? What has been your inspiration?
In 1963 I moved to Mumbai from Bangalore and stayed in the slum – Manukhurd Janata Colony. This is where I started my work – but not with any ideology or any commitment. I did not come here to do some social work. I happened to be in the slum and looking out for a job for my survival. And then I consciously or unconsciously started relating to the community and started doing things spontaneously. 

With this sort of accidental beginning, how did you develop this philosophy that nothing comes free and one has to pay for what one wants?
In 1958, 4000 families were dumped in Mankhurd Janata Colony. Nobody gave them anything and they survived. They had to get water connections, they had to get electricity and people were able to build their houses. Tell me is there a single example where urban poor have been given anything free? So what I thought was that development or improvement in our life does not come free. 

General perception is that basic amenities come free. So how do people take it when you go and tell them that nothing comes free and that you got to pay for services you get?
They look apprehensive initially. But then I argue with hard facts. I ask them what has come free to you? Has your spouse come to you for free? Does your child cost you nothing? Is this house free for you? Tell me what is free for you? Then why do you fool yourself? And they agree.

Often we find that houses in slums are pucca houses and with good interiors which could easily cost Rs 10000 to Rs 50000 or even more. What one wonders is how they can spend such amounts on unauthorised construction? Do you tell them that instead they can spend the same amount for a legitimate dwelling?
We tell people that they will have to move some day and it is not their permanent place. So they do not build expensive solid structure. It is only in regularised slums that you find pucca structures. You will not find them on the pavement. Even the corporation wanted to build toilets for us but we said we do not want toilets encroaching upon pavements. Because we do not want to be permanent here, we want to go. 

But then where are you going? What sites are being given for slum rehabilitation? I ask squatters who asked you to come here?
You came, found this land and squatted here. Now you have to move and hence find place. And now you find place in consultation with the government and according to the policy for urban poor. There is land for the urban poor in every city according to the National Policy and you have to avail it. 

But does a city like Mumbai have land for slum rehabilitation?
We have more than what we can accommodate. The problem is mismanagement. We are allocating land for fine arts societies and stadiums and what not. And you have land for them but you do not have land for the people who build your city. 

Then there are some (mis) conceptions that slum-dwellers do not want to move to any distant location since they are used to their places nearby their areas of activities?
When they move, there is a problem for getting their children admitted to schools in new areas.

Exactly, does authority ever consult slum-dwellers to be rehabilitated on what is their choice? Does it explain to them how they could live in the new place and would it involve them in the decision-making?

Suppose the slum dwellers are consulted for some alternate site, would they agree or disagree to the site?
Of course they would. See nobody wants to stay here in the central location and in such inhuman conditions. They do not ask for land at prime locations. They want to be treated with human dignity and want to be consulted. They wish that the relocation should be with proper planning complete with basic amenities and facilities like schools, creche, dispensaries etc. 

All these things we want with concern. If the authority does not have concern, does not consult as we are the recipients and merely wants to throw us out, then definitely we are not ready for it.

You have been saying that the government, politicians and officials are not receptive to people and their representations, in the states other than Maharashtra – especially Mumbai. Why is it so?
See, we have been fighting on the streets for our rights and demands. But we felt we need to change that and get information on where and what kind of land is available. And then, we started talking to various officials since last ten years and slowly we succeeded in convincing them what we are saying. 

You find distinct difference in the attitude of officials in Mumbai and elsewhere in India. Do you think you can apply the same model at other places too? Can you also convince government official in other states?
Yes! All other cities are looking at Mumbai and what it has done. Today, if it could be done in such a crowded city like Mumbai where land is so precious, then why it can not be done in other cities. Now I get invited by the state governments of Orissa, Karnataka, Tamil Nadu, Madhya Pradesh, Uttar Pradesh etc and they want us to go there and organise urban poor in their cities. 

Tamil Nadu government wants us to enumerate the pavement dwellers’ problem, to assess and quantify these problems. 

What percentage of Mumbai population lives in slum?
As of today, 60 per cent are urban poor living in slums, chawls, dilapidated buildings. Of  this 60 per cent, 40 per cent live in slums. While 30 per cent of the slums are regularised, still 10 per cent slum dwellers are illegally occupying the land in Mumbai. This means about 1.2 million out of Mumbai’s 12 million population live in unauthorised slums. Even the so-called regularised slums are in dire need of adequate infrastructure. And this has been due to the failure of policy makers.

The government, to begin with, has adequate budget for the slum improvement. But there is no proper mechanism. So we i.e National Slum Development Federation (NSDF) took grants and raised donations. Also slum residents contributed and our toilets, for example, are not free and we have to pay Rs 100 per family. So we build and manage our toilets permanently while what government builds becomes a monument in less than 5 years. 

What is the reach of the Federation and SPARC? What percentage of slum population is reached out?
We are working with 2.30 lakh families i.e. about a million population in Mumbai. Now to reach out to the remaining 4 million slum population of the city, any NGO can come and replicate our model. We are ready to help them. And every day, hundreds of people come to work our way. 

Other than NSDF and SPARC, there are many other organisations working for the slum rehabilitation in their own way. To get all these entities together would be a wrong dream. Because each one has its own ideology, own funding, own accountability etc. Some say it is entirely government’s responsibility and let them do it or why should poor people be made to pay etc. e.g Shabana Azmi famed Nivara Hakka Samiti stresses on rights of the people and raise huge political slogans like right to livelihood etc. It is the need of the society but that does not mean that it is the only form. 

When I say I have right to livelihood, I do not just question the authority but I question myself. I come here, I live here and the administration alone is not responsible for my bad living conditions, I am myself too responsible. 
And here other people disagree with me. 

How do you raise resources for Federation and SPARC?
We count mainly on our strength i.e. each of our beneficiary from 2.30 lakh families. Every fifth person is an activist. And they are the ones who are driving the movement and I am not driving anything.

Under National Slum Dwellers Federation we have Railway Slum Dwellers Federation (13000 families), Airport Slum Dwellers Federation (23000), Pavement Slum Dwellers Federation (20000), Bombay Slum Dwellers Federation which looks after private land and the collectors’ land, Dharavi Vikas Samiti. But we are completely decentralised and community leaders lead the respective movement. They are planning and delivering. 

As you say if there is willingness on the part of the people to change and even the government response is not so bad or is rather encouraging according you, then where is a missing link? Why things are not showing up?
There are hundreds of acres of salt pan land lying vacant for 50 years. The Salt Commission closed in 1952. People traced this fact and we brought the Central and the State government to hold dialogue and told them to give some of this land to house one million squatters. And this will come through. The Chief Minister requested the Central government to at least give 50 per cent of the land for this purpose. And entire slum problem of Mumbai can be easily addressed through this salt pan land. Some 300 hectares is enough for a 225 sq ft tenement for 1.5 lakh families that are illegitimately occupying land near railways, airport, pavements etc. 

This is for 10 per cent urban poor having no legitimate land. But the 60 per cent city’s population that live in regularised slum, chawls and dilapidated structures also need to be considered for providing better living conditions. But these people have to help themselves first. e.g. We are building 5000 houses in Dharavi which is a SPARC project. Builders wanted to enter but we said no.

This is going to take time but the city will change. But you are all in hurry and want to change at one stroke. It does not happen that way. You take 4-5 pockets, change one ward and make it as a model others would follow. We will change scenario for footpath dwellers in 2 years time. 
So if you start taking macro view and start planning like Antulay saying that we require Rs 40000 crore, 400000 people and oh.. the whole thing is lost.  We are asking for Slum Rehabilitation Assistance (SRA) model and leave to people to decide and do not allow builders in it. Only where it is commercial area, it is okay if builders cross subsidise for us. So let the people come forward and adopt SRA to help themselves.
And this is what my NGO friends have not understood.

What is your feeling about getting the prestigious Magsaysay Award?
Yes, I am happy to get the award because it has come at a very right time as recognition to the struggle of urban poor. I will use it to see how urban poor can be helped to develop themselves. I do not expect somebody to come and develop us.
Now we want to see how we can set a fund – Urban Poor Development Fund – where one can donate say Rs 25 lakh or so. And people from slum also would contribute Rs 25 lakh.  Make it into initial corpus. With this core finance, we can have our own bank for Urban Poor Housing like you have National Housing Bank. 

What is your stand over the Railway Slum Dwellers’ case filed by Citizens for Just Society?
Our position is that everything is ready and in the pipeline and we need 18 months time to rehabilitate and give the cleared tracts to the Railway. The court has looked into it but this NGO - Citizens For Just Society – just vehemently wants to throw slum residents saying they are pick-pockets.